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Author Topic: Rhetorical tricks of esottery  (Read 1197 times)

ama

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Rhetorical tricks of esottery
« on: July 31, 2008, 09:46:27 AM »

From http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org

[*QUOTE*]
----------------------------
# pecon 21 Jul 2008 at 7:28 pm

“the evil that happened to that poor woman is an example of how evil can triumph when good people do nothing.”

Oh baloney. You take one case and magnify it into a catastrophic threat to human survival. What about all the poor cancer victims who die in spite of your toxic and expensive treatments?

You have not studied and rejected all CAM treatments based on scientific evidence. You just pretend that you have. You are sure they can’t work because you don’t understand how they could work. And you don’t understand because they don’t fit your materialist ideology.
----------------------------
[*/QUOTE*]

So let's analyze...


[*QUOTE*]
----------------------------
You take one case and magnify it into a catastrophic threat to human survival.
What about all the poor cancer victims who die in spite of your toxic and expensive treatments?
----------------------------
[*/QUOTE*]

These are typical statements by esotters. There is an insane logic  behind that. It works like this:

1.
Esotters cannot count and they DO NOT WANT to count. They ALWAYS come up with anecdotal stuff.

This way they shove away ALL the victims of esottery. If a "healing" method somehow has one survirvor, the esotters will NOT say that the chance of survival is 1:1000, they will claim "IT WORKS!"


2.
Even if there are NO healing effects - or, worse, there are no survivors at all - the esotters will cling to their "healing" method. But WHY and HOW? Answer: With an insane argument: "We KNOW it works."

You might think that only idiots would argument that way. Yes, you are right with that, but you should consider our German government to react JUST THAT WAY. Concerning homeopathy and anthroposophic "medicine", German politicians DECLARED: "We know it works." They even went further and claimed: "These methods have been proven successful."

How could they do THAT? Answer: Take trick number 1.


3.
Esotters reverse cause and consequence.
Esotters take the wrong part of the statistic selection.

"pec" does it: "What about all the poor cancer victims who die in spite of your toxic and expensive treatments?"

"pec" does not say: "What about all the poor cancer victims who SURVIVED BECAUSE OF your toxic and expensive treatments?"


Esotters can be so deeply insane that they claim that 98 percent of all "school medicine treated" cancer patients die, AND that their guru has a healing method where more than 95 percent of his patients survive. BUT they cannot even show ONE SINGLE survivor of their guru's method.

To stress this even more, they claim that "school medicine" does not want to let their guru's patients survive, an so there are none..

Not all esotters are that insane, but there is a very broad range...


Clear fact: one cannot discuss with esotters. They live in their mental "somewhere", but not on this earth.

You NEVER can convince them as their "logic" is THE BASE to their existence. Even scratching their "logic" would immediately show, that they are nuts, that through all their life they messed up everything, that they are responsible for grief, sorrow, and even for death of family members. To get rid of that guilt, esotters MUST never confess that they are wrong.

The consequence is, that even slightest scratching of their pseudointellectual surface makes esotters PERSONALLY ATTACKED and puts them in rage. As they have no real facts, they use even the most stupid, aggressive and imbecile tricks and rhetoric to fight against their "attackers".


You see: One cannot discuss with esotters, one must write ABOUT them and uncover their methods. We do this for more than a decade now, and ... IT WORKS! :-)


Some short example:

[*QUOTE*]
----------------------------
You have not studied and rejected all CAM treatments based on scientific evidence. You just pretend that you have. You are sure they can’t work because you don’t understand how they could work. And you don’t understand because they don’t fit your materialist ideology.
----------------------------
[*/QUOTE*]

1.
One major trick of esotters and snakeoil-dealers is to put the burden of proof onto those who oppose them.

One MUST NOT fall for this trick! There are several reasons associated with this trick:

a)
Even if - in a study - it were possible to prove that the esoteric method is wrong, the esotters win years of time. During this time they have

-- ad 1 the additional boost BECAUS OF THE STUDY to claim that "even school medicine is trying it".

-- ad 2 years of time to make big cash because they are not blocked of, but instead (see above) are SUPPORTED by their critics.

b)
Most of the studies would be illegal because of unnecessarily endangering/risking the lives of the probands.

So it is absolutely impossible to make these studies. DESPITE THEY DO KNOW THAT, esotters insist on such studies. We find many examples for that in the anti-vacc scene. These "persons" even insist on destroying OTHER PEOPLE'S vaccination shield. The anti-vaccs in Germany wanted in a public petition to the Bundestag to stop that insurance companies pay the HPV vaccination. More than 1000 lives can be saved EACH year, and so the anti-vaccs obviously do want these women to die...

c)
If such a study would prove that the esoteric claim is wrong, the esotters STILL would go on with their wrong claims. The best known example for this is hompeopathy, a pile of insane lies, which for more than centuries is spread across the continents and cost uncounted lives.


If "alternative" medicine WERE trustworthy, its proponents would behave honestly. But they don't, see a, b, c.


2.
Esotters defend their "science" by claiming that the critics do not understand them. This is one of the most widely used and most primitive lies. And it is so very easy to use. Even the dumbest bloke is very fit in using it.

An example:

[*QUOTE*]
----------------------------
You just pretend that you have. You are sure they can’t work because you don’t understand how they could work.
----------------------------
[*/QUOTE*]

One cannot argue about that because esotters are autistic. So, all one can do is to SHOW IN PUBLIC how damned stupid esotters are. And this really IS easy to do.


3.
Esotters do not live on earth:

[*QUOTE*]
----------------------------
And you don’t understand because they don’t fit your materialist ideology.
----------------------------
[*/QUOTE*]

Whatever science may bring, esotters do not accept it. To make their insane world keep on going, they always take it out of the real world. The rhetoric trick: "You just cannot measure it, but this does not mean that it does not exist."

Esotters develop "super-science". An Austrian claims to dry walls with energy coming from "space". Several "scientists" work with it, but no real scientist can measure it. "BUT IT IS THERE!" Interestingly, although it cannot be measured, this energy can do PHYSICAL work. The best work: it sells esoteric stuff...

Here is an analysis of such a messy "science":

http://www.fgf.de/publikationen/newsletter/einzeln/NL_04-01/Betrachtung_Theorien_Meyl_NL_01-04d.pdf

(Sorry, seems there is no English translation available. But, please, ask the FGF if they would translate it. The other newsletters by them ARE translated.)


So, this "super science" exists, does work, ONLY the school medicine" or "mainstream science" is either to stupid to accept it, to measure it, or to prove it.

What is this? Answer: This is magic. Magic is only for those with insight, for knowing, for the elite.

This trick is a multifunctional tool. It is an EXTREMELY stupid bullshit, but even the greatest idiot ever can handle it easily.

-- It EXPLAINS why "school medicine" or "mainstream science" cannot find it, measure it, use it or prove that it does no work or exist.

-- WHATEVER "school medicine" or "mainstream science" would do or say, EVERYTHING would PROVE how stupid they are.

And if it is not stupidity (no, not all are stupid), then it is them being bought by "the "pharmamafia", by "the big industry" or by another cartell.


The big catch with this

"What is this? Answer: This is magic. Magic is only for those with insight, for knowing, for the elite."

is, that those who claim, that they know, put themselves up as THE ELITE.

So, even the greatest idiot ever is part of THE ELITE.

Really, you cannot dare to touch that, don't you?


Even the greatest idiot ever is part of THE ELITE. This shows why it is so important for them to have this shield: it makes them important. Perhaps it even makes them the rulers of this world...

To take away this base would make their whole world collapse. So we, the scientific thinkers, are aliens to their world. That we want to destroy their world makes us insane aggressors.  


But it really IS easy to crack this.

Point 1: You CAN NOT discuss with esotters. You only can demonstrate how damned stupid they are.

Point 2: Esotters ARE stupid. They have no facts, they even cannot count.

This can be demonstrated e.g. with the homeopaths, who all the time CLAIM about their healing success. But they are too damned stupid to COUNT the succesful cases and the insuccessful cases.


In this web-site there are long discussions, but they won't lead you anywhere. Go to the basics, go to the facts ... and see how esotters bite into the carpets.

ama
( rhetoric in the war against patients: )
( http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_rhet.htm )

ama

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Rhetorical tricks of esottery
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2008, 01:32:41 PM »

Nachschlag, in http://www.theness.com/neurologicablog/?p=347#more-347



># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 1:53 pm

>Most of these diseases are related to the unnatural
>modern lifestyle.

Yes, that is correct. The unnatural lifestyle makes children survive "children's diseases". Very nasty, very nasty. Weeding out at least 20 to 80 percent of the children before the age of 20 is a good idea to clean the gene pool.


>Nature is a great genius and creates machinery that
>you could not dream of creating even if you had
>billions of years.

Yes, that is correct. To build a virus or bacterium from scratch IS a difficult task.


>Yes, the process is evolutionary, but it is not
>haphazard, and you have absolutely no rational basis
>for claiming that it is.

Yes, that is correct. All is working as designed in G_D's plan. Even the extinction of mankind fully applies to the sketchbook.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 1:56 pm
>
>But decades of dementia would probably not happen
>very often in individuals with a reasonably natural
>lifestyle.

Yes, that is correct. All those people who get all these absolutely unnatural things like appendix-surgery, vaccinations, or antibiotics... Without all this unnatural stuff they never would become dement. They never would become old enough to become dement.


>And yes, people live longer now thanks to antibiotics
>and surgery, so dementia is more likely. But I don’t
>think that explains the epidemic we have now.

Old people flooding the scene is so unnatural. Yes, right you are!


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 3:24 pm
>
>“Meanwhile biology is full of example of sub-optimal
>design due to constrained evolutionary history.”

>Sub-optimal by your standards.

Yes, that is correct. We all are GENIUSES. So it is clear that we are NOT suboptimal.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 3:29 pm

>Natural evolution did an amazing job.

Yes, that is correct. Evolution creates a broad range of species, and then weeds out. The latter process is very interesting, and we should not interfere...

>Lifestyle probably contributes greatly to AD

Yes, that is correct. Life in all of its forms contributes to AD.


>because the system is not equipped for decades of
>almost complete muscular inactivity.

Yes, that is true. Especially the brain is not equipped for inactivity. It even is not even equipped for activity... Evolution is a great thing...


>It also has trouble with highly processed food and
>synthetic chemicals, because these never existed until
>very recently.

Yes, that is true. Before bananas were invented we could not eat them.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 3:35 pm
>
>The American lifestyle attacks the system and
>eventually it breaks down, although this may take
>many years.

Yes, that is correct. Evolution did an impressive job with the human blueprint. even nuts, donuts,  and do-nuts need quite a time to crack the body down.

>Middle age and old age is when it really catches up
>with us, although now young kids are also getting sick
>because the lifestyle has become increasingly lethal.

Yes, that is correct. Living in the savannes is a great thing. Evolution takes only the best.

>You could study how the unnatural lifestyle attacks the
>system, rather than blaming nature’s poor engineering
>skills.

Yes, that is correct. Nature is absolutely perfect. Mankind withstands all illnesses and lives forever.

>That is why your approach is backwards — you don’t
>these diseases as the eventual result of repeated
>attacks on a tough and elegant system. Instead, you
>see the diseases as something we would expect,
>regardless of lifestyle, given a shoddy and
>haphazardly designed system.

Yes, that is correct. Our cars are shoddy. They have brakes and windshields. The DNA has repair mechanisms. All work as designed. And as a reset-button we use the defi.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 4:39 pm
>
>I am saying that your search would proceed differently
>if you were more respectful of nature and took a more
>systemic (non-reductionist) approach.

Yes, that is correct. I am a strong proponent for mankind-free zones.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 4:45 pm
>
>I am saying that extreme inactivity is probably a major
>contributor, as well as manufactured food and
>chemicals.

Yes, that is correct. More precisely: ALL is a major contributor.

>Of course you can live a perfectly natural lifestyle and
>still get sick. But I don’t think we would have this
>epidemic of dementia if our lifestyle weren’t so crazy.

Yes, that is correct. Crazyness is an epidemic.

>And medical research would be more effective, in my
>opinion, if the body were seen as an amazing piece of
>strong, intricate and flexible engineering, rather than
>as a pile of junk that just happens to work occasionally.

Yes, that is correct. The body is a perfect construction, and what this construction does not handle is a clear sign, that this body is only fullfilling nature's great plan.


># pecon 01 Aug 2008 at 8:52 pm
>
>But we are capable of seeing our mistakes once the
>consequences become obvious. We are capable of
>improving our lifestyle and giving our bodies what they
>need.

Yes, that is correct. We do see that we do a lot of mistakes, so we rewind time and restart again. Anyone with a perfect body can do that.


># pecon 02 Aug 2008 at 8:37 pm
>
>Mainstream medicine has finally accepted what
>alternative medicine had been saying for decades —
>that lifestyle matters.

Yes, that is correct. Mainstream medicine accepts that alternative medicine says so.


># pecon 03 Aug 2008 at 8:07 pm
>
>But what if the drug supply is also contaminated? How
>will your obese patients survive without their diabetes,
>blood pressure and cholesterol drugs?

Yes, that is correct. Nature's plan does not include any artificial drugs.



What else can I say? I am delighted. pec runs as designed. :-)


># Fifion 01 Aug 2008 at 1:55 pm
>
>Would it be possible to use the same “pec disclaimer”
>here as Harriet created for science-based medicine?

You mean something like this:
http://www.transgallaxys.com/~kanzlerzwo/showtopic.php?threadid=4030

The most unearthly tough forum on earth. :-)

Sildenafil

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Rhetorical tricks of esottery
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2008, 09:16:15 AM »

"Great cinema", oder so ähnlich. :-))))
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